For this post, I want you to write about whatever interests you with respect to the novel.
Here's what interests me at the moment: I find that I have a hard time talking about this book sometimes. I can analyze Oskar & his psychological makeup, and how the hurt and pain and confusion and guilt result in his endearing idiosyncrasies, crazy outbursts, and the obsessive quality of his lock-and-key search. I can talk about the things that make me laugh, like the Hamlet scene and the session with Dr. Fein. But I have a hard time talking about the things that really move me, and there are a lot of them, because I don’t know what else to say except that they move me. The chapter from the grandmother’s perspective, My Feelings (p. 174), is like this. Thomas and grandma have such opposite responses to the tragic losses of their lives, one drawing an iron curtain around himself (nothing), the other become a moth flying toward a light (something). One lacks courage, the other confidence. Grandma can certainly be frustrating in her lack of independence and confidence. On the other hand, though, I understand her. I understand why she would give a trick-or-treater dressed as a ghost two $100 bills because she was paying the ghost of Anna to go away. (It’s like Holden Caulfield paying the nuns $10, as if money can buy back your innocence.) I understand why she would be willing to compromise a lot, practically everything, to feel the security and comfort and warmth that comes with basic human connection. And while Thomas’s inability/unwillingness to live is also frustrating, it makes more sense after hearing his account of the firebombing of Dresden. How could he live after that? After losing not only the love of his life, but his unborn child, his family, everything. Add to that the guilt of leaving his family to look for Anna. I won’t even mention having to shoot an ape, twice, who looked at him with “understanding” but not “forgiveness.” The two of them are like magnets pushed apart by some repellent force (something, nothing; something, nothing). The conversation in the airport, played out by pointing to phrases already written in the notebook, is heartbreaking. Nobody pointed at, I love you — because nobody could. It is a very sad thing, in real life not just books, to hear older people look back at their life with wistful regret. If I were able to live my life again, she says, I would kiss my piano teacher. And send ugly photographs. Makes you want to do things — listen to the voice that speaks to the beating of your heart.
What interests you?
I think that it is interesting that the grandmother writes multiple times that she wanted to just give up on the day her son died in the tower, but she didn't because "That's who I am." Somehow, through some uncanny pure instinctual will to survive, the grandmother is able to put on a brave face and keep on doing menial task when she had just lost her only child. Comparing this to Thomas's reaction, as Mr. Harrington has done, does bring out their differences, exemplified by the somethings and nothings. I love the relationship that Oskar and the grandmother have. Although Oskar said that he does not know much about her, like her history, they seem to have a mutual understanding and a symbiotic relationship. By that I mean, Oskar is able to provide what the grandmother needs most, "When I looked at you, my life made sense," giving his grandmother's life and her survival meaning. And she gives Oskar companionship and understanding, even when he does not realize it. The scene under the bed is a perfect example of this, not to mention incredible touching. Although Oskar and his grandmother cannot face each other and they lay side by side. The grandmother feels as if she is suffocating but she stay because she knows that is what Oskar needs. Also, I think it is interesting that Ron keeps being mentioned by Oskar, yet we never actually meet him. Maybe if the readers met him, Oskar's biased opinion and description would seem trivial and we would be able to make an opinion ourselves rather than being manipulated by Oskar's nine year old, traumatized brain. Lastly, I think it is selfish and kind of despicable for the grandfather Thomas to come back right when her son died, even if that is why he left and that he would have been an absent father if had stayed.
ReplyDelete-Ciaran
Oskar and Grandma under the bed together: a perfect symbolic summary of their relationship.
DeleteI would like to start off by saying that, Ciaran, to call the grandfather despicable for coming back after his son died is, I can be frank, a horrible thing to say. I believe the grandfather says himself somewhere in the book that he very unsure of his life from the moment almost everyone he ever knew died before his eyes. He admits to not being perfect. He left because the idea of losing someone just like when he lost Anna and his child was unbearable to think about. While I think we can all agree abandoning a child is wrong, and i do believe that, you can't really comment on this because you have never had your life ripped away from you like that. None of us have. It is something I've only heard talked about, and it is unimaginable horror. It left his grandfather with fear of loss, so much so that he would rather run away from that loss then fell it again. Unfortunately, when his son dies on 9/11, he does feel that again, and he knows that his wife does too. Thats why he comes back then, because he knew that she never really felt that in Dresden, but feels it now. It's defiantly a two-fold issue to think about. Anyway, onto the part that tugged at my heartstrings most in this section, and that is the shooting of the zoo animals. I have a deep place in my heart for any animal out there, and having to read an entire page about how he had to kill every single one of them almost brought me to tears. I can only imagine that he had the same feelings i did towards animals, the down/up-side to reading fiction, and I could feel his sorrow for having to, over and over again, shoot innocent creatures. the ape is the most daunting of all because he thought he had laid him to rest. Looking in the eye of anything, be it human animal or otherwise, and having to take its life is too much to ask of anyone who has just seen his entire life explode in front of his eyes. I think it really shows how tragedy, 9/11, the Dresden bombings, what have you, forces unfortunate and ugly consequences that ultimately can permanently effect you. Ok, i'm done. Can't wait to talk about this book in class, it is SO GOOD!
ReplyDeleteOne wonders: what happened to all the animals that grandma let go after Thomas left? Perhaps they became a wild pack of feral dogs & cats & hamsters wandering the streets of the Upper West Side. A different book perhaps.
DeleteAnimal Gangs Of New York: A Sequel To Extremely Loud And Incredibly Close
DeleteI am most interested in the way Oskar interacts with people and the difference between the manner with which he treats strangers and his family. He is often more open and affectionate to people he has barely met, than to his family. For example he during his first encounter with the “renter,” or his grandfather, he explains the intimate details and personal truths of his life that he withholds from even his mother. In addition, he shares perhaps the thing closest his heart, his father’s voice message, after knowing the man for less than a day. I feel this is because he assumes the absolute best of people before meeting them and as he interacts with them they rarely meet his high standards. The strange part is that he never changes his beginning opinion of people even though he sees major flaws in most people other than his father and his dog. I am not sure if this is caused by Oskar’s craving for person to fill the emotional hole that was left after his father’s death or is Foer is attempting to emphasize the tendency of most people to have the absolute opposite assumption. Perhaps Foer is a trying to teach the audience a lesson because each of Oskar’s acquaintances greets him with kindness and support for his quest, he even got extremely close to kissing one.
ReplyDeleteThe duality of the men in pain in the book really captured me the most. Oskar's attempts to deal with his pain compared to his grandfather's attempts creates depth and interest throughout the book. Both are searching for someone they have lost but they go about it in different. Thomas' silence and Oskar's erratic thoughts are obvious examples of their depression. Thomas' silence, from a rational point of view, seems ridiculous. But, as Evan pointed, the anguish that he has had to go through and Anna's void he is trying to fill with Oskar's grandma makes his situation more understandable. I got into it a finished the book on my flight so I find it difficult to talk about the book without revealing too much information. The grandfather missing his son and the grandson missing his father create a interesting confluence of ideals and belief. Oskar is looking for closure while Thomas is looking for redemption. Their grief and longing drives the emotional side of the novel. This creates an interesting organization and path that the novel follows.
ReplyDeleteI just wanted to start off saying that what Ciaran said is quite understandable, and that Evan calling what Ciaran said as horrible was in itself kind of mean. I can feel the same emotions that Ciaran feels towards the grandfather, why abandon your kid for "their good" and write a last letter and never see him again until he's dead? It made me really angered when the grandfather left, me being a romantic at heart, my heart broke too when the grandfather left for good and having him come back when he's dead.... UGH.. infuriated me...
ReplyDeleteNow that I huffed and puffed my anger out, I just wanted to say, that I love the way that Foer writes the stories of the stranger. I can't quite explain it but when he talks about the grandma and AR Black when he heard his voice and started crying I have this feeling as if I am good friends with AR Black now too. Also that Oskar's frustration with the physiatrist is my own, sounds creepy but this makes me more "involved" with the book as I read further into the novel.
Lastly, what intrigues me greatly is the way in which Oskar deals with his emotions. The amount of energy and skill Oskar uses to conceal his emotions. It interests me whenever Oskar pulls out his "feelings book" from underneath his pillow. Then after showing sooome emotion,for his mother's sake he switches to humor, then "optimistic, but realistic", because it was "better" for both of them. In my opinion I feel as though sometimes Oskar takes on feelings and ideas that the grandfather has expressed in the stories that he tells Oskar. That his leaving was for Oskar's dad and his grandmother's good. Changing to humour was for his mom's good, him being out is for his mother's good.
Also, what do you guys think about Oskar in "My Feelings" when he talks about his dad's hand and his grandfather's hands and asks, "Will you have those hands?" Do you think there is an underlying meaning to this? And also, do you feel as though Oskar feels insufficient in that he can't live up the his dad. Because over and over Oskar tells his mom that his dad isn't a spirit, isn't in the funeral box, saying "his memory is here" while pointing at his head. I feel as though Oskar feels that he has to live up to what he dad was and how his dad thought. Whenever he finds something he doesn't know about like the bulb and other instances Oskar allows responds to himself by saying, "dad would've known..." What do you guys think? This kind of stumps me.
Building on an idea that Evan sort of brought up, It is interesting how the disasters are paralleled in the bombing of Dresden, Hiroshima, and 9/11. First of all, it is extremely unlucky for the grandparents to have lost people they love in Dresden and 9/11. Similar themes tend to come up in each event. Emphasizing the survivors' regret for not communicating their love to their dead family is a major similarity. It is also interesting that in each disaster there is one person who is able to move on and continue living and one who has trouble. In this respect, Oskar is like his grandfather and his mom is like his grandmother. Although they express it in different ways, Oskar and Thomas are unable to continue living their lives normally, while the mom and grandma are able to move forward(for the most part). The issue raised by Evan and Ciaran is quite complicated. First of all,Thomas never wanted a child; the grandmother broke one of their rules by getting pregnant with him. Second, it is clear that Thomas is a tortured and conflicted soul. He clearly cares about the grandma and his son because of all the letters and the fact that he did come back. I support his decision to leave for the sake of the grandmother and the son. He was clearly in no state to raise a child in a healthy environment. Thomas is not despicable for coming back, it just shows that he really cares about his family.
ReplyDeleteI agree with Ciaran that it was despicable for Thomas to leave when his son was born, and only come back once he died. Although Thomas' experience in Dresden was very tragic, it still does not give Thomas an excuse to abandon his wife and his child. That is why this chapter was so hard to read, not only because of Thomas' account of his experience during the bombings, but mainly because of how detrimental this was to him, even years later. While all of Thomas' close relatives and friends died in the bombings, so did a part of Thomas. That part was the ability to love, and that is what is most tragic. Thomas was lucky enough not to get killed, but because of his past, he basically has wasted his second shot at life. That is what I find most tragic about his account. Perhaps if Thomas had found a way to cope that wasn’t closing himself off from the future, and living in the past, the future would have been much more different for Thomas and the rest of his family.
ReplyDeleteThe thing that interests me most about this book is the vast quantity of inconsistencies. I mentioned a few of these instances in class. 1. Mr. Black would not have been able to hear the doorbell when Oskar rang if his hearing aids were turned off. 2. Mr. Black would not have been able to order food and other things on the phone if his hearing aids were turned off. 3. Mr. Black would not have been able to talk to Oskar’s mother on the phone if his hearing aids were turned off. 4. Just because something has a large mass, does not mean it will have a magnetic field. I do not care how many nails were in the bed, the reason things have magnetic fields is because there is an electrical current flowing through them, or in the case of the Earth’s core, they are liquid, very hot, and churning at a constant rate. Thus, the bed would have just been heavy. 5. The taxi story was extremely contrived and incredibly unrealistic. 6. I don’t care how many times Oskar bugged Stephen Hawking, he would never get a personalized response like that. 7. What happened with the French lessons? Did the teacher believe the letter? 8. If Oskar lives in an apartment, where is he supposed to get pebbles to throw at the renter’s window? 9. The Grandmother’s letters are quite strange and are not realistic because no grandmother would write about her love life to her grandson. That to me is really creepy and plays into the underlying themes of voyeurism and various other sexual complexes. 10. Oskar’s knowledge of language is inconsistent. 11. There is no way they would just let some lady chill in the Empire State Building for years on end, especially right after September Eleventh. 12. If the grandmother came over right after the towers were hit, how would Oskar be able to go buy a new phone at Radio Shack? 13. In the Japan story, there was not enough time for flies to lay eggs and maggots to hatch. 14. On pages 180-181, the book says that the yes and no are rubbing off onto Thomas’s face, but that is not possible because they are tattoos. 15. The book refers to latitude and longitude in terms of degrees, minutes, and seconds. It gives the seconds out to three decimal places. This is an error because seconds never go beyond the decimal (250). 16. The Empire State Building is 102 stories not 86. The 86th floor is just the observation deck for all of the tourists, I know because I have been to the 102nd floor (248). This is what I have been thinking about in regards to the book. I can go on, but I am tired as hell. By the way, I cannot believe that we have not talked about all of the bird references because usually birds are of some symbolic significance. Additionally, I am surprised that we have not talked about how this book is similar to One Flew Over the Cookoo’s Nest because both have shrinks, birds, controlling women, and a dude who doesn’t talk. –S. Armstrong
ReplyDeleteThe thing that interests me the most about this book is the brilliant juxtaposition of Oskars search for the lock and the stories of his grandma and grandpa. It seems that the hot button topic of this blog entry is the grandfathers decision to abandon his family, so I'm going to throw my two cents out there. I agree with Rosana and Ciaran and whoever else who said that he had no right to abandon to his family. I feel like his story is almost meant to serve as a cautionary tale for Oskar, as there are manifold similarities between the two stories. In one way or another, both Oskar and his grandfather are dealing with extreme tragedies (the grandma is going through this as well, but for some reason I am more intrigued by Oskar and the grandfather). Certainly, what Oskar's grandfather went through was horrible; no one should ever have to experience all the terrible things that he experienced. After reading his story, my initial reaction was one of sympathy; I was totally ready to let him off the hook for abandoning his family. However, as I put more thought into the story, I began to change my opinion. I understand that all of the grandfather's terrible life experiences have stunted him emotionally, but that doesn't make it any more acceptable for him to run away from his son. Whether or not the agreement was "no kids," and whether or not he wanted a kid, he got one, and with that comes a certain amount of responsibilities. Oskar's grandfather handled his grief in about the worst way he could; he allowed it to consume him and to dictate the rest of his life. It is in this way that I feel that his story is meant to be a cautionary tale of what could possibly happen to Oskar. Clearly, Oskar is also struggling immensely with his grief over losing his father, and his grandpa's story provides a perfect example of a worst case scenario for how Oskar could end up.
ReplyDeleteThis book interests me in many ways and there are certain parts that really make it spark. I love the fact how everything jumps around and the characters are all over the place. Oskar's brain blurts random thoughts but once the paragraph is over, the reader is able to realize that it all seemed to make sense. Although, it takes a good eye to realize what all the random facts mean and where they are coming from. Personally, I don't think I would be able to figure it all out without the class and the daily talks we have on each assigned reading. A sudden spark of my interest occurred when I observed the way the characters deal with death and sadness. It seemed like Oskar was very sad but it was more important to him to find answers than just letting it go. Oskar wanted more than to be closer to his father even though he passed. He felt like going on his quest would bring him closer to his dad, it also gave him something to do and feel good about. In all honesty, I've never seen someone deal with death that way but it seems like a logical reason instead of putting everything behind and dealing with loads of sadness. His grandfather also sparked my interest. I feel as if he was a coward for leaving his family. Of course, he was going through a tough time but that's life and theres always people dealing with tragedies. He needed to dig deep and push through it. What he did was gave up, but he didn't think of the side effects like hurting his family and just making matters worse. Although, this story can be used as a cheat sheet for Oskar because it shows him exactly the opposite of what he should do.
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